Disturbing News on the Hollie Greig Campaign.
This week has been a very important week in the Hollie Greig story after last weekends programme on Manchester Radio Online with Tony Legend. On Tuesday with only nine days to go before the General Election, Alex Salmond made an unannounced visit to Aberdeen to open a workshop for blind people, think of the kudos that would give him so near to the election, yet he chose to do it without informing the media. On the same day Nick Clegg cancelled his pre-arranged visit to the Granite City-no reasons given. The mainstream parties seem to be running scared of being drawn into our debate.
On Wednesday Robert Green, the broadcaster and journalist, who has brought this campaign into mainstream thinking has been ordered to appear at Stonehaven Sheriff Court today, unaccompanied and the proceedings are to be dealt with in camera, in other words no members of the public are allowed to be present. This is after his Aberdeen lawyers ditched him last weekend quoting “a conflict of interest”. They represented Anne Greig ten years ago. This whole scenario has to be seen to be believed, against a man who was arrested for peacefully handing out leaflets. His Scottish aides are now, as I type, looking for a non-crooked able Scottish lawyer to handle the proceedings. Is there a chance?
In the meantime the computer system of The Palestine Telegraph, the only newspaper that has consistently taken up Hollies story, have had their computer system hacked and Lorraine Loudon who is a leading campaigner for Hollie has had her Facebook page shut down with its 26,000 contributors. Also last night there was another hustings debate in South Aberdeen organized by BBC Radio Scotland who told the Scotland Against Crooked Lawyers (SACL) representatives that their policy precluded any other than the four main parties from attending. However leaflets were handed out before the doors were shut and the debate continued until it collapsed 45 minutes later.
Clydeside Television are covering the comings and goings with glee for if nothing else it is all grist to the independent television producers mill. There main aim besides trying to get justice for Hollie is to make and distribute a programme about this affair. So their main immediate thrust is to get the campaign proper and sustained legal representation. They and Greg Watkins from Stolen-Kids-Hollie.blog.com, the official Hollie blog, are telling all supporters to use this next week as a period of reflection and entrenchment while the political process comes to an end and are desperately asking anyone in Scotland, if they can, to help the SACL party in Aberdeen during these next few days.
As Lorraine says you could not make up all this activity if you tried and the Establishments sphincter must be well and truly twitching and the media professionals must be having nightmares thinking of all this unpublished and unbelievable copy going to waste. This whole campaign says something for our lily-livered and squeamish media, but it does show everyone where the power at this moment lies.
So Hollie entrench away and ensure your next few steps are guided by proper, just and honest counsel. There must be someone who fits the bill out there, who would be willing and able to fight wisely for Human Rights in this paragon of virtue, Great Britain.
Tags: Aberdeen, Aberdeen South, Alex Salmond, Anne Greig, BBC Radio SCotland, Clydeside Television, Greg Watkins, Hollie Greig, Lorraine Loudon, Manchester Radio Online, Nick Clegg, Robert Green, SACL, Scotland Against Crooked Lawyers, Stolen-Kids-Hollie.blog.com, Stonehaven Sheriff Court, The Granite City, The Palestine Telegraph, Tony Legend
April 30th, 2010 at 7:43 pm
I can assure you Paul, glee is the wrong word. The programme we are making is in fact concerned with more general failings in the child protection system here in Scotland. Hollie’s story whilst of immediate concern on many levels is peripheral to the tale we will eventually tell.
Hollie’s story concerns us greatly because of its pressing nature, and the danger of the issue becoming one of those that is hidden from the world in the plainest of plain site.
To that end we seek to comment openly and objectively on matters, in the hope that whatever happens there is at least one commentator seen to air a balanced view out there. And perhaps provide a perspective that allows others to find a means of presenting the issues in the more mainstream press.
If that at times means we need to report what people need to hear rather than what they want to hear then that’s as it must be. But there is no absolutely pleasure or ‘glee’ in it; and to be frank I would much rather be up a hill somewhere in Scotland impersonating Tom Weir!
As much as great strides have been made by the Hollie Greig team it is clear that a more measured and advised approach is needed… If nothing else to ensure Robert remains a free man able to go about his business.
Where the law is concerned the only sound advice can be to see somone who is properly educated and experience and be guided by them. And where the media are concerned the information must be ‘outed’ in a way that is responsible and ‘safe’; that is to say in a way that does not jeopardise the very goals we all have in common…
May 1st, 2010 at 9:44 am
Matt,
Thank you for pointing that out and I accept your ticking off. Glee is certainly the wrong word to use in this context. This case has affected me so much I feel I have to get my thoughts out as
quickly as possible. I should be more circumspect in my text and certainly re-read a piece a few times before publishing but that is emotion for you.
I ewill e-mail you on another matter.
Paul Malpas
May 2nd, 2010 at 3:49 pm
Paul,
FYI the character Greg Lance-Watkins has been exposed as a charlatan and “sacked” from the campaign. Anne Greig has not regarded his blog as official for many months.
Lorraine Loudon was not an admin of the main Facebook group. It was effectively controlled by “Pabs Diabs” (aka Pablo or Paul Phillips) who claimed last week that he was closing the site on the instructions of the “Main Hollie Team”. When this was exposed as a lie he changed the story to say that he had been planning to do this but Facebook closed the site themselves.
Evidence has come to light in recent days that Greg Lance-Watkins & Pablo have co-operated to destabilise other causes as far back as 2008.
May 6th, 2010 at 1:31 pm
Paul great piece ,but I would have to say that Matt cannot be classed like GLW by any stretch of imagination,rather he was playing Devils advocate ,and wisely as this goes up the tree we have to make sure our defences from accusations of foil hat wearing loons are sound.
Robert Green knows this and knows where they are weak but as he said(or didn’t not to me anyway:)),the other side are much bigger and better armed ,they have gagged our main man and have illegally taken and lost information,hardly a fair fight.
I don’t know what happened to Hollie and her mum ,but I believe Angolini and its clear she and the Scottish government believe Robert Green with their disgusting Soviet style arrests and gagging orders.
Roberts actions could have been dealt with in a civil court,if they were not true ,but instead the full weight of this disgusting Scottish legal system and government has come down on his head.
So if Angolini by her actions believes Robert and Robert believes Hollie and her mum,then thats good enough for me.
As for where this goes I believe we who support Robert Anne and Hollie must help fund a civil case in England against the father,He will dont come back to defend it and with that win we move on to pick off the next one ,frog 1 ,who for legal reasons will be nameless.Bring him down and this house will fall.
I may be wrong,I often am,but if it walks like a duck quacks like a duck and flys like a duck,its a cover up!
I BELIEVE ANGOLINI ROBERT GREEN IS RIGHT!
May 7th, 2010 at 2:36 pm
Im a good friend of Pabs/Pablo FYI..JT (Dale Cooper) I feel I should let you know you left a few “key” bits of information out of your totally untrue statement above.
Pabs/Pablo being one of the two original admin on the Facebook group had left the country just before the group really took off, and knew he would not be online for a few months so he appointed a few “new” admins (yourself included) to keep the group going in his absence.
During this time the group started to take off, some of the admin (yourself again included) started to get alittle “power drunk” banning good people, for no other reason than they disagreed with some of the things happening within the group ie; PAYPAL accounts being setup for donations to “advertising” ect…while most others (myself included) bit their lip, some of the the more conspiracy minded thought the proceeds were being withdrawn by the admin, they were NOT…but it caused futher division.
Having been advised time and time again that this was a very bad idea and could effect Hollie’s case if it ever came to court, the accounts were allowed to continue. This in turn totally split the group and drove a wedge between people who “believed it was a “bad idea” and people who basicly didnt understand and thought “why not donate?”…it was going downhill from there onwards.
Remember pabs/pablo was still offline almost clueless during this time(he would rarely flick by limitedly from an internet cafe ).
Then pabs/pablo gets online and returns..he gets hit from every angle by everyone and takes a few days to read into what has happened..and promptly takes back the “borrowed reigns” re-appointing JUST the original two admins that started the group, puts out countless statments saying as much.
Then gets a hate campaign going after him, because the now redundant admin are now back on a level were they have to listen to critisism or leave..they cant just ban people anymore.
Some of the “retired admin” (yourself included) blame Pabs/Pablo for making it look like they did somthing wrong,Pabs/Pablo issues statment after statment fully explaining to the group that they have NOT done anything wrong (all he can really do at this point seeing as they already made their own bed).
The offending site with the PAYPAL account was also promptly removed from the main Group page but the damage was already done.
And as for Pabs/Pablo being Greg Lance-Watkins?….Lol Wow..
x
Col
May 7th, 2010 at 11:20 pm
Curious – Unless I have been hypnotised at some point I am 100% positive that I have never in my life met GLW let alone been involved in any causes with him and certainly not destabilised any. If you do have any ‘evidence’ of this I would be most interested to know of it as it is frankly inpossible. I have left the administration of the Facebook group for exactly this reason – unfounded suspicion and conjecture. Not only has it been directly harmful to the campaign but it has ventured into libelous defamatory and downright upsetting. I kindly ask that you respect my decision to step away from what is now a circus of speculation and refrain from asserting untruths against my name. I anticipate seeing this ‘evidence’ and also seeing this lie retracted. Thank you.
May 7th, 2010 at 11:47 pm
ps my message was in reference to the comment by ‘JT’. Would you see that JT becomes aware of my request to see the ‘evidence that has come to light’ – thanks
May 8th, 2010 at 4:10 pm
Pablo & Colin
A few points:
1. I am not “Dale Cooper”
2. I work closely with Anne Greig who believes that Greg L-W is an “obnoxious arsehole” and has never heard of Pablo. The reason Anne trusts me is because I am a doer not a “keyboard warrior”.
3. I do not believe I have ever claimed GLW and Pablo are the same person
4. GLW and Pablo appeared together on various blogs in 2008 & 2009 singing from the same hymn sheet. The real Dale Cooper has full details.
5. The “paypal” dispute was obviously manufactured by the likes of “Daisy Idwal Jonees” & “Tom Caumont” to deflect attention from emails from “gg” who claimed to be Hollie’s brother.
6. It has been discovered that the “gg” emails were sent from Spain, where I believe Pablo lives.
May 8th, 2010 at 5:32 pm
Hello,
I generally resist getting embroiled in commentary like this – particularly that which is in the public domain. However, I must post on this as there are several comments that are flatly untrue or confused and not well researched.
Pablo is my boyfriend and has poured weeks of his time into the campaign to bring about an investigation for Hollie. Hundreds of people have, of course, some more than others, and some above the call of duty. And like you intimate, JT, it’s doers and not keyboard warriors that is what’s needed here – I completely agree.
Pablo did speak with Anne, but only on a few occasions, having more predominant contact with Robert in the early-ish stages of the group on Facebook during February before he – Pablo – left to work away at sea for three weeks. As Colin quite rightly says, he had scant access to the internet during this time. Two days after Pablo came on leave from work, he and I moved to Spain. That was on 23rd March.
JT, your remark intimating that Pablo posed as the ‘gg’ character is untrue. The time in which these sequence of comments were posted, we (Pablo and myself) were nowhere near Spain. In fact, as I recall, this heady exchange of messages between ‘gg’ and Matt Quinn happened while we were completely offline and before we caught our plane from the UK. We did not get our internet connection in our new house – in Spain, sure – until the Easter Weekend in April.
‘gg’ therefore remains a complete mystery. In truth, I have trouble remembering the verbatim of the exchanges, both on the forum in question and on the discussions board on the ‘main’ group where it was all subsequently linked. All I remember is that Matt Quinn was extremely alarmed by his exchanges with ‘gg’ – and understandably so if ‘gg’ was either Hollie’s brother for real, or some (very unstable) person pretending to be him.
You’ve not explicitly accused Pablo of being ‘gg’, JT, but in intimating speculation, I must emphasise that this is not the case.
I can confirm what JT has said about Anne’s reservations about GL-W, although when I spoke to Anne about this (I spoke to Anne and Robert on many occasions during the three weeks Pablo was away at sea, from the end of Feb through to late-ish March) she didn’t call him an obnoxious arsehole. But I don’t think she would over the phone anyway. Anne absolutely told me that she often wasn’t happy with GL-W’s blog posts, or at least, how he appeared to write the narrative as if it were Hollie’s words. But to be fair, this is all she told me so I can’t comment any further. In fact, Anne was even reluctant to tell me GL-Ws’s name over the phone.
Anyway, I would be keen to see the blogs you’ve mentioned, where Pablo and GL-W have appeared together over the last two years. Could you post up the links so that we are able to see the nature of these appearances?
Apologies for butting in here, but my concern – subsequent to my concern for Hollie and Anne having this crucial and very necessary campaign derailed – is that there is a dangerous amount of very grave assertions and aspersions being cast on a very personal level.
Please accept that I do not intend this (very long!) comment to be aggressive: I don’t, but I can not ignore uninformed accusations or speculation being leveled at Pablo – or anyone for that matter.
Plum
May 8th, 2010 at 5:34 pm
Thank you JT. I have written to the real Dale Cooper in order to get my facts straight – something that is quite lacking in this circus. So to address your points;
1. Thank you for clearing that up. Are you John Taylor?
2. It is a shame that Anne doesn’t recall me phoning her a week into getting the main group started although she must recall speaking with my girlfriend, most days for 2 weeks often a few times a day and at length, during the time I went away for work commitments. If it is of interest to you in getting this straight she may remember me as Pabs or Paul also. If she doesn’t I dont mind. I remember speaking to her and thats all that concerns me. Robert and Stuart may/may not remember also.
3. I don’t believe you did. I am told it was the spurious Mr Drockton who did but quickly removed this invention for fear of exposing himself as a gossip mongerer.
4. If ‘GLW and Pablo appeared on various blogs…….’ then it must be someone else who goes by the name Pablo. I know it was not me. I have asked the real Dale Cooper to substantiate this claim. If you have evidence of this yourself please present it. If you are going on hearsay the ice is thin. I didnt know of G L-W until I came back from working away.
5. The paypal dispute that I am aware of is quite clear – is more a matter of lack of attention to detail, steamrollering, stubborness and bruised ego. More calamity than conspiracy.
7. I knew nothing of the ‘gg’ emails until I got back and discovered an enormous catfight. I did write to Matt Quinn to seek some light on this matter that was buried under the catfight but was met with a vile and delirious response which I will share with you if needed. Do you know when these emails were sent?
Thank you.
May 9th, 2010 at 1:35 am
I am privy to more than most about the Hollie Greig case (you don’t need to know who I am or how I know so much, I just do) and I can confim the following re the above dispute …
1. Anne spoke to Pabs’ girlfriend several times (conversations about Peter Eyre’s obnoxious emails, Greg Lance-Watkins’ “Stolen Kids” blog and much more besides, when Pabs was working away) and she also spoke to Pabs as he states above. FACT.
2. Greg Lance-Watkins was indeed a very close confidant since early 2009, privy to very sensitive and confidential documents (he still is of course) and was involved in the case long before “John Taylor” had ever heard of Hollie Greig or attempted to hijack the campaign for his own very selfish and self-serving ends – the week after Robert’s initial arrest I believe. FACT.
3. Taylor should be very careful not to denounce people without the FACTS of the case before him. He might just end up in court on defamation charges. FACT.
4. Taylor and people generally should also be very careful that their real I.Ds don’t come to the surface amidst their ego, chest-thumping spats online – it might just prove VERY embarrassing, revealing and damaging to all concerned. FACT.
Pabs is a great guy who I back and support 100% … against self-serving, ego-maniacs who think they are SO superior, but who are really just pathetic little fools who really should just crawl back into their holes whence they came … before they are exposed to the wider world …
Nuff said … unless you dare to retaliate that is.
May 9th, 2010 at 10:20 am
Here are the links which show “pablo an ex pat” and Greg Lance-Watkins singing from same hymn sheet on a variety of topics.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/yourview/1582880/Are-you-concerned-about-Antarcticas-melting-ice.html
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/earthcomment/geoffrey-lean/6468103/Its-time-to-pluck-the-golden-goose–of-green-taxation.html
http://mccannexposure.wordpress.com/
http://catcomm.ru.pledgebank.com/search?q=mor
May 9th, 2010 at 12:58 pm
Excellent – well done!
We wont deal with the amount of Pauls that moved to Spain and assumed the name Pablo yet as that is a minor detail.
So given the FACT that I moved to spain in March 2010 (something that Dale Cooper / JustyC / Lyn was and is more than aware of) lets look through those links shall we.
1. March 26th 2008 is the last posting here. mm 2 years before I moved?
2. There is a Peter Watson on here too – denouncing climate change. Not something you’d expect of Levy & McRae?! Or maybe there is someone else called Peter Watson in the world? And maybe more than one Pablo? Ooh there’s a ‘James’ on there too. Could this be James Ellis the ‘creator’ of the FB group? Oh there’s Pablo an ex pat on October 30th 2009. Still a full five months ahead of when I moved to Spain. And by singing from the same hymn sheet do you mean that these two men are savvy enough to see through the global warming scam? Dont tell me you’re frightened of the climate changing please. I am struggling to help you with this bogus roundabout as it is.
3. Amazing – there is someone on there called Pablo commenting. Not sure I could see any sign of my good buddy G L-W though. Maybe you need to help me see the light on this connection. Also I’ve never visited that site before and its certainly not a view I would hold.
4. I’m not prepared to waste my time going through this ridiculous website looking for a spurious connection between me and GLW. If you feel this is your critical piece of evidence then I suggest you direct me more accurately to it.
THIS MAKES YOU LOOK UTTERLY RIDICULOUS!
So there we have it – CLEAR CUT PROOF(‘nt) – that I and GLW are in league with each other and that I am the only person in the world named ‘Pablo’ and managed to send emails from a country that I had not yet moved to. I will be more than happy to sit in court and watch you submit your ‘evidence’ to prove that your statements are not libelous and/or defamatory.
Now then ‘John Taylor’ – do you want to retract your statement with a full apology and get your head together about what damage you are actually doing or shall we move straight on to lawful proceedings?
I do not need to hide behind a false name. Pabs is a well known nickname of mine. I also have been very open about where, when and what I do for work, where I live, my girlfriend etc etc etc
Unlike you ‘John Taylor’ whom I shall publish all of this with your real name shortly, along with some factual information about ‘Dale Cooper/JustyC/Lyn’, it would be of great interest to a lot of people as to just how you garner your misinformation to spread around whilst hiding behind false names.
With people like you riding Annes sodden coat tail i am gravely concerned. You need to question your conscience and motivations very strongly, honestly (in a mirror) and quickly before you bring the force of common law (do not cause harm injury or loss) down very heavily upon you and those around Hollie.
DO YOU UNDERSTAND?
Now – as I am familiar with the shadowy style of Dale Cooper the secret agent fantasist less commonly known as Lyn a forty something woman that lives in Belgium and has several cats – I trust she too will be reading this and skulking off to find another way to attack me – what Lyn really needs to do is accept that she screwed up a bit. Granted she was under attack but this doesnt mean she didnt screw up. Accept and apologise for the mistakes you are accountable for and the need to blame others will dissipate.
I’m sick of defending myself to paranoid vengeful idiots who see me as someone they can lash out at. Those that know me well know I have a high tolerance level and persist with amicable attempts to resolve things up until a point. Then I switch. There is no grey area.
SO if you are an honourable man with nothing to hide and nothing to fear – The next posting by ‘John Taylor’ needs to have an apology and a retraction with your real name on the end of it.
I expect nothing from JustycDaleLyn for then I will not be dissapointed.
If I dont have a response in 24 hours I will consider this communications closed and proceed in more fitting and lawful manners of resolution. Do I make myself clear?
May 9th, 2010 at 1:52 pm
I. Am. Flabbergasted…
JT, you truly, truly reckon these nebulous blog posts are watertight corroboration of the sickening fallacy that has taken Pablo’s name in vain??
You say you are working closely with Anne? Are you advising her in any way? If ‘evidence’ such as the Pablos commenting in the links you’ve provided is the kind of ‘evidence’ that people appear to be more than happy than drawing their conclusions from, wow… And yikes.
Best of luck, JT – you’re really gonna need it.
May 9th, 2010 at 3:33 pm
…oh theres a “real dale cooper”? sorry I was under the impression that was aslo a false name…one which that party(probly two or three people) let many believe was male? I really cant see the point in hiding names…why not just come clean? use your real name my god… anything you do on the internet is fully tracked and databased why lie? use you real name and discuss this probly so least we dont get caught up in a game of who’s who?
May 9th, 2010 at 3:54 pm
my email address if you would like to contact me personally is …ltroonster@btinternet.com
May 9th, 2010 at 5:21 pm
JT – you didnt answer the question – Are you John Taylor?
You said you were not Dale Cooper.
I have emailed the ‘John Taylor’ that has emailed me several times but no response yet.
I have good reason to believe this to be one and the same.
For such finger pointing and accusation and piousness – having a false name or not actually answering the question as to whether JT = ‘John Taylor’ doesn’t give me much hope that Anne is being particularly looked after. Particularly when you base your acussations on such ridiculously flimsy ‘evidence’ passed on from someone who names themselves after a fantasy detective and refuses to acknowledge crucial errors that led to a cataclysmic row. Pride comes before a fall they say…
So just in case you forgot the question…
Are you (JT) John Taylor?
May 9th, 2010 at 6:58 pm
The interesting thing about these people that post untruths freneticly all over the place at an alarming rate under false names is that they go remarkably quiet when presented with unequivocal TRUTH.
May 9th, 2010 at 7:00 pm
So some more background; ‘JT’ emailed me some time ago when he and the foul mouthed Matt Quinn (that is clearly like all the other bounty hunters seeking a purlitzer prize or suchlike for ‘scooping the big one’ without regard for the Human Being that is Hollie) got their accounts disabled. They will be so deluded that they think they got pulled by ‘the man’ because they were ‘on to something’ that they will have failed to have considered that vile abussive defamatory upsetting behaviour can be simply reported by the victim and FB will look at the complaint and if it is a breach of the T&C that are agreed on opening the account will be closed. Secret agent? No – foul mouthed liar. Lets see if Matt comes back with any pearls of wisdom and evidence for his accusation against me in the lovely exchange I have here on email. Again a string of accusations and ill reached conclusions with no substantiation yet again. Investigative journalist? No – out of control fantastist.
May 10th, 2010 at 11:32 am
I know you from youtube, ltroonster. So whose side are you on? The side of the genuine carers who want to see justice over the Hollie Greig case done, such as Paul Drockton with his very helpful radio show telling people the facts, or Sandra Barr who has got a page together for concerned citizens, and Stuart Usher to name just 3 people, or are you on the side of these other characters, who seem bent on slandering the aforementioneds work at every occasion, plus doling out pointless untrue character assassinations of the same thrown in which have nothing to do with anything, plus a whole load more of uneccassary crap that has nothing to do with the subject at hand. Their exaggerations about these good people pales in comparison to their efforts, from what I see, from say, Paul Drocktons efforts,to name just 1 person on their hate list, yet they laughingly claim theyre the be-all and end-all of everything to do with the case,but actually do very little, from what I can see. Please, if they do anything, show me. Ive never seen any of their work and Ive been here for weeks making and spreading videos, sending hundreds of emails to tv cos, lords, baronesses, newspapers etc and scores to “prominent” people.
All I see from these people here are bad vibes and disruption…..butlincat.
May 10th, 2010 at 11:55 am
The question remains,why pull the fb page two weeks before Robert Green stood for office,Observer shame on you,JT isnt Dale and JT walks and delivers flyers right in this beasts territory
May 10th, 2010 at 3:26 pm
This is such a mess, very little can be done now to salvage the Facebook side of things, all of this personal stuff is taking away from the campaign and whoever set it all up has played a blinder.
Pablo, you had the chance to nail your colours to the mast when you came back from being ‘at sea’ and you made scapegoats of Maggie and Dale. Instead of thanking them for all the work they had done with the campaign, you booted them off and took days to make a statement. During those days their reputations were almost destroyed but you didn’t care about that. Then your pals Daisy and Tom turn up demanding that StolenKids is promoted on the Hollie page, and pushing the paypal issue making it into something which it certainly was not.
If you are as innocent in all this as you say you are then it looks as if Karma has served you a good healthy dose, and maybe you’ll think twice before you stab people (hard working caring and good people) in the back.
May 10th, 2010 at 8:46 pm
A message from Tom George, “Scots Against Injustice” …
This is all a very very sad state of affairs.
All the quarrelling factions and two-faced back-stabbing was the main reason I had to stand down from Hollie’s case last weekend. The war that broke out between Messrs Drockton and Watkins on my, now defunct, “Scots AgainstInjustice” Facebook Profile Wall on Tuesday 27 April 2010 led to me being caught in their cossfire and, as I had taken Watkins side when Drockton issued his “him or me” ultimatum (I still await his profuse apology for that), I had no alternative but to issue a public resignation statement and step aside on Saturday 1 May 2010. I also wrote to Stuart and Robert personally on Friday 7 May 2010 to elucidate about “Why I felt the need to resign from the Hollie Greig case … “.
I have come across many people over the past year whilst being heavily involved in Hollie’s case – some who are sincere and genuine people and others who have obvious ulterior motives and should really question why they became involved and whose interests they were really trying to further. I would like to state publicly here that everything stated by Pabs and Plum above is all factual and I regard them both as sincere and genuine people whose motives in Hollie’s case, like mine, were purely altruistic and their detractors should be thoroughly ashamed to have denounced them in the very malicious way they have. They are both good human beings and simply did not deserve the vilification that has spewed forth their way over recent days and weeks.
As for my involvement in Hollie’s case? It has been a major learning curve and I am so sorry that I made many many mistakes along the way and never got the impartial and independent inquiry into Hollie’s case, “care” and treatment I had fought for since last year when I first got involved and tried to help Hollie and Anne. The record of my efforts in that regard over the months can be found on Robert’s and Stuart’s hard drives and I am sure they would support my claims in that regard in need be.
Greg Lance-Watkins does, I agree, come across as a very arrogant and obnoxious individual (I have told him that on several occasions!) and that is often the case with those who are articulate and intelligent. But he has done everything he says he has over the past year in Hollie’s case and he is most certainly not a “deranged, mad or evil” individual – nor is he a “government agent” either. He is, I suspect, rightly very annoyed at all the bile and very venomous unfounded allegations laid at his door over the past fortnight and obviously feels badly let down by Robert and Anne at not being told officially that his free advice and free services were no longer required. I don’t necessarily agree with the way he has gone about things over these past 10 days or so, but these are now his firmly held views and he has as much right to express himself on his public forum as anyone else does on theirs. If that makes me the “Devil incarnate” too for saying that, then so be it.
I have other very serious, sad and tragic cases I am vigorously pursuing presently against the authorities in Edinburgh and, yes, Aberdeen too and I am committed to fulfilling my obligations to the people concerned. I hope my rapidly declining health does not negate me having to pass these cases on to others to help with and I can see some kind of satisfactory resolution for the individuals concerned.
I will leave you all with my parting comments to Stuart and Robert in my email to them both last Friday 7 May and hope, after all the recent infighting and disharmony, that people reading this will see through the error of their ways and at least TRY to put all the very foolish flaming, name-calling and retaliation behind them … well, we live in hope!
Closing remarks to Stuart last Friday 7 May …
“I wish you, Robert and Anne well for the future and I hope that Anne and Hollie can somehow, someday, get the justice they seek; get some much-needed peace of mind and harmony in their lives; and move on to a much happier and healthier place – well away from all this torment and turmoil that has been their lives over the past decade or more”.
Lang may yer lum reek wi’ ither folks coal …
Toodle pip …
Yours aye,
Tom
Edinburgh
ScotsVInjustice@aol.com
07791-226-490
Monday 10 May 2010
May 10th, 2010 at 9:54 pm
I’ve been asked to apologise to DaleCooper/JustyC/Lyn for ‘bringing them into it’ which I cannot do becasue if they are sharing spurious links to try and tie my name to a person who is out of favour with the madhouse I’m of the thnking that that is bringing it on yourself. Stop making your own petards to hang yourselves and get to grips with reality. I’m out of here now as they say… you cant reason with the irrational. I’ll leave you with this. Bye
A reply in my inbox from someone who wrote to me as JT / John Taylor. I havn’t had a reply to my question on this thread but feel it fair to share all information so that a balanced and fair assessment can be made.
‘John Taylor to me’
show details 8:06 AM (14 hours ago)
My diabolical friend,
This is the last communication I will have with you. I believe that it it is probably Jimmy Tarbuck who is commenting on the Paul Malpas blog.
Kind regards,
Stephen Maskrey
May 11th, 2010 at 8:54 am
Thanks Tom
I take on board everything you say,however I was surprised that having been privy to the Hollie Grieg information much longer than most other people GLW hadn’t drilled down more into the facts before printing the accused names and the fact he chose to do it two weeks before the election did make me wonder?
Robert has said to me that only 2 or 3 people have all the info he has,like you he has a hard drives packed and up his sleeve for a rainy day.
GLWs public vilification and aggression toward Sandra Barr,someone who I have had run ins with in the past ,and accusing her dead father of abusing her is beyond the pale and makes me wonder at at about your other comments about GLW.
With regards to Pabs again I cannot understand why the FB group couldnt have been kept open for another 2 weekS until after Roberts election,we were told that it was frozen that it was taken off thats what really made me wonder what was going on,and still does.
John Taylor and his guys handed out the flyers right in the heart of Aberdeen with the police coming to doors to check on who was handing them out,I think that says all anyone needs to know about John and his team they handed out over 40000 flyers in less than a week.
John Taylor is not Dale and as I said to Paul Drokton Pabs is not GLW who then corrected it.
Well done to Stuart Usher and Robert who have risked bankruptcy and jail
As for the Hollie Grieg case I dont know what happened to Hollie and Anne ,I wasn’t there but I don know what has happened to Robert Green and something is definitely wrong in the state of Denmark
I hope too you are not Observer above,that would be the biggest personal disappointment to me on this,more than losing the 27K,
I wish you well Tom a lot of people have been hurt with this case and I hope your health keeps up
In the short time I have known I considered you a true friend ,not a face book friend but a guy of the old school how bat with a straight bat
GMKOMD
May 11th, 2010 at 12:20 pm
George – I will say it again – i hope one last time. I nor James closed the group. We had every intention of freezing it to stem the flood of abussive commenting, speculative accusations, off thread linking to lizards and zionists, demands for justice when the priority should always (and has been for me) to get an investigation. No investigation without substantial evidence and there is no basis to command justice. I am sickened at the false reputation that has been pinned to me and others who have insisted upon this and have thus been accused of awful things for not agreeing to join the burning scythe witch hunt. So if the basis for you being against me is me closing the group then you are gravely mistaken.
i think if you look at the ‘evidence’ provided above (with a reasonable mind) that is typical of the methods being used to hang me you will see how ridiculous this tangent has become. Also if the success of this campaign hangs upon a facebook group we are well and truly screwed.
I have apologised for any mishandling during the chaos that I returned to enough times. I now wait for Robert to live up to his ‘gentleman’ insistings and provide us with some substantial evidence to make all of the unconditional trust and dogmatic belief worthwhile. I am feeling extremely gutted as to the psychotic charade that has come out of a genuine attempt to assist and feel terribly responsible for what potentially is very damaging to all those that came with hope.
Not shouting but emphasising with 100% honesty – I DID NOT CLOSE THE GROUP.
May 11th, 2010 at 2:16 pm
Well if TG speaks for you it means a lot,and I genuinely like young Jim.
As you are aware I did say to Paul G that you were not GLW and to be fair he correted it that day .In addition contrary to what your trained aggresive monkey says(yes him) ,I did support you when I thought you were right
I dont know what happened to the 27000 fb group ,I wasnt there,but whatever happened I was angry that it went 2 weeks before the election and at the same time GLW desides after 2 years to ask some questions?
I was angry at the paypal was hijacked by people who are now no where to be seen ,I am angry that mags and dale were crucified for because of my idea,which according to some was for self advertising,haha yeah right.
So far this ego trip has cost me more than just 5k,I wish I had never heard of this case ,or this group,and with the exception of some really good freinds I am sick of it.
As for Daly he hasnt said its nonsense and the states actions against Robert confirm for me what I came into this for ,Robert Green has found something the state dont like and are trying to do everything they can
to destroy Robert Green.
One thing keeps me going,the fact that my government has gagged a 62 year old man for breach of the beach,something is indeed rotten in the state of Denmark and its pretty shite in Grampian too.
You have to ask yourself ,what are you prepared to do!
May 11th, 2010 at 3:25 pm
Thank you for correcting the sensationalist bedroom broadcaster on a very big mistake re me being GLW George. I hope this did serve to highlight to those left with a modicum of common sense and decency just how educated this Master of Arts indeed is. I assume his degree was in fictional writing?
I’m really not sure who the ‘trained aggressive monkey’ you speak of is as I have no monkeys, let alone trained aggressive ones. There are more aggressive monkeys in this house now than there are sane seekers of factual evidence to bring about the necessary procedures. I fight my own corner and if anyone takes the role of aggressor on my part – and I have become aware of it – I will have written to them in private to ask them not to do take such actions in my name.
What people do of their own free will is their call and I am not responsible for them.
I will however not back down when my name is slandered and demand to see the EVIDENCE of their accusations which I will genuinely apologise for and seek to rectify if they can be presented or demand retraction and apology if not.
I too have invested a great deal in this case and if Robert is to stick with his demands for gentlemanly behaviour he will surface and take responsibility for this shambles that has developed. I certainly am not happy with having asked to see the proof of his claims (and still not received) that I have vehemently stood by on a matter of unquestioned belief and genuine trust. This has been my biggest and most foolish mistake for which I am mostly concerned and sorry. To be told he knows nothing of me when I and my girlfriend have had long conversations with him many times leaves me feeling betrayed and used and dubious of his ability to seek support from any unquestioning campaigner that jumps on board.
My name is mud amongst many people (mainly those that fail to accept it is investigation we need, before we demand justice) and if this doesn’t reach a better state soon my name will be mud for those that have honoured me with the same trust I showed Robert.
All the chest beating and self congratulation wears thin with me as it is all ego. I was on the streets the day after robert first got arrested with flyers and megaphones, huge phone bills, sleepless nights, MP visits, all whilst trying to maintain a calmness in a panicked group.
I’m told by the guy I trusted with the back up group I had set up in the event of being pulled that my ‘ticket to heaven is cancelled’!! This shows the insanity of delirious ego. To think that they can decide what God knows as true to be wrong because it doesn’t suit them is vile.
I have on several occassions stood up for Mags and Dale/Justy/Lyn and apologised for the one error I made in publicly addressing my concerns to those that were attacking them, this was read in bad context with angry eyes and I could have dealt with it better. I have however apologised many times and also publicly stated that they were not guilty of anything. The only thing I have not been happy about and said all along and still stick by is Dale/Justy/Lyn’s refusal to take down the PayPal ad whilst we sorted the mess out and also the refuslal to remove external links on the Newssenses website, particularly the wikilinks one. Those were things that bothered me and I felt would bring trouble. They did. But still stubborness and pride continues to try and reflect that mistake onto me. It doesn’t wash. Consequence has a habit of finding its target eventually so I’m not too bothered.
I will not give up on seeing a resolution to this case but now my stance has shifted because I cannot camp with delude evangelists who claim the right to demand something that they have no proof of. Only Robert and Anne can possibly make a difference now. I pray they have what they say they have or else there will be an awful price to pay for those that genuinely came with hope for change. Unfortunately it will not be those that saw it as an opportunity to undermine governance, seek glory, elevation or whatever twisted agenda that motivates them that will suffer any backlash.
I thank Paul Malpas for allowing this thread to continue although his one sided attack and defence of those who present utter tripe as evidence is far from commendable.
JT still refuses to answer the question as to his real identity and still refuses to accept the evidence he presented (from Dale/Justy/Lyn) to assassinate my character as pathetic.
There are none so blind as those that refuse to see.
There is always Love and hope to guide us should we choose
May 11th, 2010 at 4:12 pm
Pabs I think JT quites rightly keeps his identity hidden,my name is my name,stupid but there it is,I really dont know if your name is Pabs diabs Frank Norman or Jimmy,nor would I expect you to tell me.
As for Paul D he seems to be for Hollie and that really is good enough for me.As for GLW I dont know how you can be involved for a case for 2 years and not be certain then to turn 180 degree against it seems to be bizarre,but then as I said I wasnt there.
With regard to flyers,there is a queer difference between what you and I and others have done to handing out flyers in Grampian police area,we have seen what they do!
I do know that John T is concerned for his family as he lives there,if we believe the Hollie Greig story then we must assume he has every right to be concerned.At one point the police came to one of the team in Aberdeen to see who had been handing them out and we had to employ a company to dish out the last 15000.
You have said here that you didnt pull the site so has James and Tom George has vouched for you,as no one knows who anyone really is I am sure this matter will die.
Its all here until Mr Malpas decides to clear it and people can make up their own mind.
As for who said what to who ,again I wasnt there all I know is that as long as the state continue to persecute Robert Green we all have to be wary and that for me is the crux of the matter.
May 11th, 2010 at 4:18 pm
Here is proof that Pabs DID close the facebook group -
http://www.facebook.com/help/?ref=drop#!/help/?search=close%20a%20group
How do I delete a group? How do I close a group?
Our system automatically deletes groups once they’re empty (no members). If you created the group, you can delete the group by removing all members and then yourself. Note that if you were not the first admin and creator of this group, you will not be able to delete the group unless the group creator has left it voluntarily.
So to close a facebook group – you have to remove the members ONE BY ONE.
Let’s assume that there were 27k members (there were more but let’s just round it up to 27k). It would probably take approximately 15 seconds to find and delete a member on an average speed computer.
Even if both admins (James and Pabs) worked no-stop with no breaks or sleep, they couldn’t physically have removed all the members in that short amount of time – it would have taken over 120 hours!.
(It should be noted that many of the regular posters couldn’t see the group itself or in the search list the day before whilst non-regular posters could see both – were the regular members being removed one by one at that time? This is a different scenario to the last time that the group ‘vanished’ when nobody could see the group).
Also – for those who can see the original group page still – take note of this post by Dalai Lada – Dalai Lada Strange how the page seems disappearing from time to time… and the link had new hollie greig fan page instead of we won’t allow title instead as it should… they better stop messing with it… ):
26 April at 16:46 · Comment · Like · Flag
Did they try to change the name in an attempt to hide the group first?
James deactivated his facebook account leaving Pabs as the sole admin. He then deactivated his account (rather than hand it over to other people who would have run it instead) which left the group with no admin to take over. That is why the group is still visible because it was NOT closed by removing the members. The links are still live and people’s avatars change in real time – the group is still there to be seen.
Facebook don’t close groups without good reason. Facebook did NOT delete or close the group. The last admin did.
May 11th, 2010 at 7:20 pm
George just to clear somthing up, when I said People doing things for “power points” I was in no way refering to yourself, what you did with the ad-van is still the best thing by far that’s been done to hightlight this case done humbly with your own money. All this backwards/forwards arguing is all pretty pointless there are no secret goverment agents bent on making the campaign fail, at the end of the day it was a facebook group, yes as we keep l stating it had 25,000+ members, but how many actually participated in anything apart from clicking “join here” 50? If that?. The disappearance of the group was only a shock to those involved, I honestly think facebook have bigger problems to worry about. Hand on heart what has stirred me was the Tony legend interview with Mark Daly, I think he did a great job of explaining his side, and I think Robert floundered at that. I’m not saying I don’t trust him but it knocked me back alittle as I think happened to a few others, bought me back to reality that I haven’t questioned this whole thing as much as I should have, and have possibly followed a lot of things blindly. Hollie is at the end of this not election campaigns.
May 11th, 2010 at 7:26 pm
Pablo – the guy who you left in charge of the back up group is angry as I’m sure he saw first hand the chaos which ensued when you returned from being away and the way you treated admin staff (which included him at that point).
There were so many opportunities for you to seek truth re the paypal account instead you decided to make it look as if you suspected people of theft then days later make a statement to say everything was fine. All the information was there in the group, a post on the discussions board from Tom George stating that Robert was ABSOLUTELY FINE with the paypal account providing that it was used for advertising costs.
Your attitude whilst running the group of deleting posts and talking to everyone like children instead of allowing them to express their feelings ruffled a lot of feathers and now you are paying the price.
People are very suspicious of you and your contradictory statements, I didn’t pull the group, I was going to freeze the group, people should learn to live without Facebook, Robert and Anne aren’t interested in Facebook etc and as for the behaviour of certain people you speak of… there have been downright disruptive people from YOUR FRIENDS LIST attacking others for absolutely no reason except to cause trouble.
Stop complaining about your reputation being soiled, no one really knows who you are anyway, it was ok for the admin staff on the old group to be in question though wasn’t it? Two of them used their REAL NAMES and you made sure they suffered. You had every chance to stop this and you did not, so the only person to blame is yourself.
May 11th, 2010 at 7:35 pm
thanks mags
May 11th, 2010 at 8:14 pm
Pablo this is not Mags, I am defending John as I am also an admin on that group. Surely you must see how all this has come about? You admit your mistakes but you still wonder why people don’t trust you? Is it totally alien to you that others may share these views, not just Maggie and Dale?
May 11th, 2010 at 9:44 pm
People need to be aware that there is some evidence of emails and blog comments being made in various places that are probably NOT from the people they appear to be… The likely source being one of the many fake email sites that can be found out there…
For those who are not aware there are a number of sites out there that offer this ‘service’ … And anyone who receives ‘doubtful’ emails should have the message examined by somone I.T.-Savvy enough to be able to examine the headers etc…
With that said there are clearly unfounded attacks being made on various people and this seems to be something of a pattern; we saw this on the original FB group. What they can’t argue with they simply spread blatant lies and deception about.
These people FEAR exposure! which is why they’re going to such lengths to try and intimidate people into silence.
In the interests of clarity, wiith regard to the ‘GG’ emails… Last I heard was that the IPs had been tracked to North Africa (Morocco) then as far as a trunk route that leads to Spain… Ceuta to Algeciras to be exact… With the ultimate source ‘probably’ some public facility such as a library or internet cafe’ much further north, possibly in Portugal.
Some lengths had been gone to in order to mask the source, and the propogation rout of this message was ‘unusual’…
We have very strong suspicions as to the authors, if and when we have sufficient proof to do so then they will be named. Suffice to say they have and continue to play a pivotal role in the campaign to derail Hollie’s case.
All we can do is stay solid, stay together, don’t be drawn by hysteria, remain objective and take whatever opportunities arise to tell Hollie’s story. Remember; divide and conquer is the name of THEIR game!
May 11th, 2010 at 9:57 pm
I was FBkd the Holle Cause and admit, I was so shocked I fell into it. I wanted to do something. Since joining the Fb groups in total innocence and with good heart I have become a troll a trouble maker a multi person. (I am not) . I believe my naivety has caused Hollie damage. I left the groups because I saw it was harming her. I believe Pabs had the best intention . I believe most have the best intentions. It is a sign of a thinking brain to ask questions. The groups do not seem to want this. As a troll/trouble maker/ multi person I submit to the pointy hats large cloaks and prodding sticks of witch finders generals but will only still say, the job is surley to just ask. We are not the answers just the questioners. I say this with humility and respect to all do not seek further prodding.
May 12th, 2010 at 9:15 am
Colin it shook everyone but Robert did say he wasnt a seasoned reporter,as has Matt has wisely pointed out .
It was acceptable for us to be suprised,I had only been doing this for 8 weeks,but after 2 years I was surprised to find the GLW was surprised,now that was a surprise.
Robert has said that only2 or 3 people know all the facts,and now you can see why
As for Daly he could have quite easily said its all shit,and if he believed it he wouldn’t have cared what Anne or Robert thought.I know if I had been lied to I would tell them exactly what I thought of them.But Daly didnt, and its more what he didnt say that speaks volumes.
Then we have our pals Lavy mcspray and the Scottish government who are
treating a 62 year old man like public enemy nr1 for what is essentially a civil matter of defamation,that itself tells me everything I need to know.
You just need to see how badly organised this was to realise we are dealing with people who were a shambles,I designed and got printed the40000 flyers ffs ,my design skills are precisely ZERO,how badly organised do you have to be that a fat 49 year old QS is doing your flyers!
But we are fighting a well organised beast
I come from a buisness/ construction background so I know how to(sometimes) organise things,
I was clear we needed a focus and a direction,I did the ad van cause Mags called my bluff but I thought fuckit maybe it will show what we can do.
The Paypal was also my idea and it was a good one,some common purpose tit Charlie someone was spouting nonsense about charity status,tell that to the mccanns their fund,with amillion quid in it was a company ,not a charity.
With money it could have allowed the fund to take a civil action against the father. Thats why the state sent in its troops(AND I DONT MEAN) PABS!
Colin you you did you bit in the group,remember every day hammering at Peter Watson Angollini and the rest,now we are hammering away at each other,does that not tell you something
May 12th, 2010 at 10:32 am
sorry about the bit above typed it on an I phone
May 12th, 2010 at 11:07 am
What has to be understood is the hope for victims Hollie’s case has brought. It has put focus on the victims of Paedophile abuse, and given a voice to the countless victims, who suffer in silence. The taking down of the main group, dealt severe blow to people who may have come forward and spoken about what happened to them. This may have provided a platform for them get help them.
No one has the right to interfere with matters they do not fully understand, and do not appreciate, not being victims themselves. I do not believe FB would have taken the group away without an announcement, knowing how sensitive this issue is, and the consequence for some in doing so.
May 12th, 2010 at 1:28 pm
What DID you do Susan ,apart from ask questions ? Was the full force of the government attacking Robert Green ,did you think they had missed something?
May 12th, 2010 at 1:28 pm
What DID you do Susan ,apart from ask questions ? Was the full force of the government attacking Robert Green not enough ,did you think they had missed something?
May 12th, 2010 at 2:21 pm
She seeks no further prodding, yet here she is. Watch your language everyone or she’ll be out to demonize you and all the good you have done, claiming her children read this blog!
May 12th, 2010 at 2:26 pm
hmm mamma1 you are correct,sorry.
May 12th, 2010 at 3:49 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A-yZNMWFqvM
Says it all really,talk the talk or walk the walk?
May 17th, 2010 at 6:55 am
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